Site n00b.. (A leecher if I've been here for more than a month and can't earn 5 rep)
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07-02-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apoc
Yes, I have a condescending tone because I am condescending. Everyone knows that. (And if you use OB, you really SHOULD know that by now) No hard feelings though, just please don't say things that you don't fully understand. (The last thing we need is some paranoia around here from some bad info )
Warden can, but ISXWarden protects against it. I won't go into details, mainly because I don't even know all the inner workings on ISXWarden. (Only 1 person does, and that's Lax... [2 if you count his wife :P])
OB.NET will be closed source for the reasons in the first post. We'd rather not have bloat-ware (OB.LS), and we'd rather be able to maintain it easier. This also makes it so people can't sell our work, with their name on it. (Obviously something we're highly against.)
We don't like the fact that MMOwned has a map sharing section, but since it IS free, and it's not our site, we're a bit more lenient. People who sell map files, and such, are just asshats who want to make a quick buck without doing anything.
Well, I don't visit the OB site much, I have very little use for the site itself lol, I don't really use the bot to do anything, I just like to write code in it
What kinds of things will we be able to edit with our own code or scripting with ob.net? Will it be possible to change the path creating that it uses? Combat of course you can change, can we get more info on what you can change or override with your own code? Also, MMOwned has a map sharing section? wtf? I didn't even see that lol
Well, I don't visit the OB site much, I have very little use for the site itself lol, I don't really use the bot to do anything, I just like to write code in it
What kinds of things will we be able to edit with our own code or scripting with ob.net? Will it be possible to change the path creating that it uses? Combat of course you can change, can we get more info on what you can change or override with your own code? Also, MMOwned has a map sharing section? wtf? I didn't even see that lol
You'll see once it's released. You'll be able to do quite alot of tweaking. I promise you that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viter
Looks great.
But will the old openbot stop?
This will be up to the OB.LS dev's. (Those that are left at least...) Personally, I won't be working on OB.LS anymore.
Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots.
So far, the Universe is winning.
Site n00b.. (A leecher if I've been here for more than a month and can't earn 5 rep)
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07-03-2008
I am not familiar with these dotnet bots and my question is will it support 64 bit OS's? I think glider is a dotnet bot and though I shudder to make a comparison to it, I know that it doesn't support 64 bit OS's, is this a problem with all dotnet bots or just Glider?
I am not familiar with these dotnet bots and my question is will it support 64 bit OS's? I think glider is a dotnet bot and though I shudder to make a comparison to it, I know that it doesn't support 64 bit OS's, is this a problem with all dotnet bots or just Glider?
It's just a problem with the person compiling it being too lazy to compile it for x64 support.
If the need is there for x64 support, we'll release builds for x64 machines.
Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots.
So far, the Universe is winning.
Site n00b.. (A leecher if I've been here for more than a month and can't earn 5 rep)
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07-03-2008
Gilder isn't compiled for x64 because of the driver component; the 64 bit windows architecture has a kernel protection module that forces a bluescreen when it detects changes to the kernel's internal data. Since this is how Glider gets around Warden, it's not feasible for them to release a driverless version for the x64 platform.
Gilder isn't compiled for x64 because of the driver component; the 64 bit windows architecture has a kernel protection module that forces a bluescreen when it detects changes to the kernel's internal data. Since this is how Glider gets around Warden, it's not feasible for them to release a driverless version for the x64 platform.
And you should really read up on MS's detour libraries. (Specifically made for x86 -> x64 and vice versa compilations)
Again, it's just about laziness. (Or possibly lack of knowledge)
Also, the BSOD error is a crock of shit. And plenty of people around here will say the same. (I personally run x64, and I never have this problem, especially not with kernel changes.)
Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots.
So far, the Universe is winning.
I realy looked forward to a .net release of openbot, but without opensource it's not the same
Well we sincerely apologize that people won't be making money selling our work. But this is how it's going to be. You never know, it may go open source at some point in the future.
Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots.
So far, the Universe is winning.
Site n00b.. (A leecher if I've been here for more than a month and can't earn 5 rep)
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07-04-2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apoc
And you should really read up on MS's detour libraries. (Specifically made for x86 -> x64 and vice versa compilations)
Again, it's just about laziness. (Or possibly lack of knowledge)
Also, the BSOD error is a crock of shit. And plenty of people around here will say the same. (I personally run x64, and I never have this problem, especially not with kernel changes.)
I highly doubt Lax uses the detours library. Also, the detours library is purely usermode; the main factor in its use is how the first 5 bytes of instructions are aligned within a function so a jump can be placed there without having to dynamically determine how many instructions need to be moved to place a detours-lib style detour. Anyhoo, if Lax uses detours, I'm sure he uses a custom detour library and analyzes the functions he's detouring to pick a good point more than a few bytes in to make the jump so that it's much more costly to detect than the MS detours lib.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_Patch_Protection]Kernel Patch Protection "In x64 editions of Windows, Microsoft chose to begin to enforce the restrictions on what structures drivers can and cannot modify. The technology used to enforce this is called Kernel Patch Protection. KPP works by periodically checking to make sure that protected system structures in the kernel have not been modified. If a modification is detected, then Windows will initiate a bug check and shut down the system"
Finally, if I were mercury, I'd probably not support x64 either just for the fact that I'd have to maintain a separate build for a platform that has a fairly small market share and that is notorious for being poorly supported in general.
First of all, thank god you at least know what you're talking about (means I don't need to talk as if you're an idiot)
Secondly, the only difference they would have (maintainability wise) is the rootkit they use to protect themselves. (Since that's pretty much the only thing they use that would/should have an effect on the kernel itself)
In which case, again, it's very simple to keep copies of both versions available.
As for the application itself, most compilers support x64 compiles just fine (from x32/86) without a hitch. (I do this very often, and hardly ever have problems)
Also, on the x64 Kernal Patching, that's been known (for quite some time) how to get around.
I agree that x64 *was* poorly supported, but that's been changed vastly within the last few years. And people are starting to see the difference in performance from x32/86 -> x64. It's a pretty big difference IMO.
Programming today is a race between software engineers striving to build bigger and better idiot-proof programs, and the Universe trying to produce bigger and better idiots.
So far, the Universe is winning.
And you should really read up on MS's detour libraries. (Specifically made for x86 -> x64 and vice versa compilations)
Again, it's just about laziness. (Or possibly lack of knowledge)
Also, the BSOD error is a crock of shit. And plenty of people around here will say the same. (I personally run x64, and I never have this problem, especially not with kernel changes.)
Glider isnt on X64 because Microsoft 64bit OS's do not use the shadow driver as it is not signed.
You can use /no driver for 64bit OS and it will work fine, it is just not recommended for the security hole that is opened. You can also run Virtual Machines to have glider on 64bit os.
anyways, looking forward to this! I just started trying openbot and Im having fun with it Too bad it is closed source, heh. As a computer engineering major, Id love to play with it in my spare time. I do understand the reasons behind you all going closed source and I have to agree with you.
Good luck and I am looking forward to this release!
)
